1000s P.O.S. intermittently will not start

[m4panther]

I'm confused anybody have a clue. It seams like the brain doesn't let voltage flow to the starting relay. I push the button and nothing happens. all checks are complete the fuel pump and the guages cycle.

I tested and have 12v at the handlebar starter switch so I ran a wire down to the starter relay and it will start the bike, but when I shut it down with the key it's doesn't sound like the starter dissengaged and if I use the kill switch it sounds like an old car with bad valves, when you turn it off and continues to run like the starter is still cranking.

I don't think the kickstand being down or clutch not pulled in with the Nuetral light is glowing. I tried every combo to eliminate those possibilities.

the problem started after refueling on a long ride it wouldn't start agian. Someone told me they had the same intermittent problem on a Honda that turned out to be the rectifier.

Has anyone else had to go throught this? and if so what was the out come?

anyone have wireing diagram?

[basser23]

Sounds to me like your starter switch is buggered.Which side of the switch did you run the jumper from? You could try to disconnect the switch and use a test switch in its place.
I think I 've heard of this before....
Chip

[DAVID THOMPSON]

anyone have wiring diagram?

i am looking i think i have one some where on my hard drive

ar dave

[LWS66]

Have you checked the fuses and relays under the seat?
I would suspect a relay. When you pop the cover you'll see one relay in line with the fuses (this is the the "daylight relay" that makes the lights come on when the key is turned on...more on that latter). The other row has three relays. Looking at them as if you were seated, the relay far left is the "power latch" relay. It controls the ECU and radiator fan. The middle relay is for the lights. The relay on the right is the "shut-off relay". This controls power going to the start circuit. Try starting the bike, see if it clicks when you push the start button, hard tap it a few times and try starting it. If still nothing, switch the relay with the daylight relay mentioned above.

If that works, I would'nt worry about getting another relay. You don't need the daylight relay. All it does is override the light switch on the handlebar (government crap). By removing it you gain the full 3 positions of the switch. No lights, running lights, or headlights. The check engine light will stay on for a while, just keep riding it and it will eventually reprogram and go out.

Has the bike gotten wet lately? Not sure if by running the jumper wire your causing something else to occur, but I had a problem a year or so ago where the starter continued to crank when running. Turned out to be the starter button contacts were wet. The clearance between the contacts at rest is too small. Packed it with dielectric grease and problem solved (vaseline works too)

I've got the service manual for the bike on a disc. It has diagrams for most of the circuits, I'll try and make a copy for you or e-mail the particular pages.

Good Luck,
Lorin

[m4panther]

I got the bike running last week and I thought I'd follow up on this post. I don't know what really worked, but I reconnected everything; the computer, rectifier and removed my jumperI put in (from the switch to the starter relay) then replaced the battery because it wasn't taking a charge. I put a new battery in and it fired right up with a tank of 7 month old gas

There is something screwy with the light switch. I might have tried your change the light relay trick, but can't remember. The only logical thing I can think of is a "hard reset" of the electronics. Just like when you internet goes out and you call tech support they tell you to completely disconnect the power to your modem. the bike sat completely dormant for 7 months with most of the electrical connections disconnected and now it works???? WTF:smt021

[LWS66]

Damn, seven months is a loooongggg time!! Good the hear you got it running, too bad you are'nt able to know for sure what it was. Hope it does'nt crop up at an inoppertune time! What do you mean by "something screwy with the light switch"?

[m4panther]

Lorin,

I thought there might have been a problem with the right handle bar swith that turns the small lights on/off, but I think I'm just not familiar with it. I'll look at the book.

For now on I'm going to trickle charge the battery every two weeks.

I have to be careful when starting it.I don't like to crank it for longer than four seconds. I think it fires in reverse sometimes; when it's cold an attempt to start it leads to a halt of the starter the lcd flashes a code and the gauges cycle again. A little unnerving... it happens more often when the battery is weak.

ever have any similar symptoms?

[LWS66]

In the past I've ridden mine so much that I did'nt bother plugging in my Battery Tender Jr....and never had any issues with cranking. But since I've recently picked up a Ninja 250 for a daily commuter (and use it occasionally for spirited rides on weekends) the MZ has been sitting dormant for longer periods, plugged in to the tender. The only thing I've noticed lately is that the cranking seems labored/erratic, this after sitting a few weeks, usually after overnight temps drop down below 40 degrees......like when in the winter when the oil is thicker and it does'nt spin as smoothly/quickly as when warmer. I've been using synthetic 15w-50 in the warmer month, 5w-40 in the colder.....this past winter I left the 15/50 in as I did'nt have enough miles on it to warrant changing. Self inflicted deal I think. Otherwise nothing odd...yet!

[LWS66]

I recently replaced to original battery with a recent AGM type (200 cold cranking amps) and it cranks over like it did when new. Original battery was over 4 years old, it's specs, even when new, show it not to be as powerful as the replacement battery I installed.

[DAVID THOMPSON]

when having funny electrical problems think of this......

on my rt125 and saxon tour every funny electrical problem has been traced back to
1 battery to small or bad
2 really nasty wiring in the handle bar stuff or a connector plugs in the harness
3 bad starter relay 2 times\
4 bad ground some where in the system
dave
i have been working on electrical things since i was about six or seven years old
and i am not impressed with the electrical systems on new bikes
the new guys are making joe lucas look like a good guy...