Neutral switch, testing

[harold]

My neutral light doesn't work, but the bulb does. I have read the archives, but don't understand what one post said. It seemed to say that disconnecting the wire, the blue one below the gear shift, you would get 12 volts from its connector coming out of the motor when in neutral. That means that 12 V is going into the motor somewhere, and then through the switch, and then out of this blue wire when in neutral.

My symptom that I just checked is this; the starter motor will run in gear with no clutch. I had no continuity in this wire to ground, in gear or not. Is that a bad switch, or could it be a disconnected wire somewhere? Should the blue wire be to ground? I have some wiring diagrams, but unfortunatly don't really understand a lot of the symbols, and they are really hard to see what wire went to where.

[Bill Jurgenson]

dunno if someone wrote, you'd get 12v. from the neutral switch but that is complete nonsense. Use your head; where would that come from. The only thing the emgine is connected to is battery minus=ground.
That switch connects to ground in neutral, the bulb always gets +12v. so the circuit is closed in neutral and the light lights. If it doesn't:
-the bulb's bad?
-the switch's bad?
-a wire is broken or disconnected?

in that order.
you say the bulb's OK.
So, disconnect that blue wire near the sprocket and hold it to the engine (bare metal).
If the bulb lights, then the switch is bad which is a common ailment. Standard Yamaha part. If you waste time trying to find it as a MZ part, it's your own fault.
If the bulb does not light up when grounded, then there is a fault in the harness. Skorpion Tour and Baggi both have potential problems with the thick section between frame and headlight which is constantly being flexed. Sport, Traveller, Cup and Replica don't because the this is not flexed.
Have fun finding the fault.
In most cases, it is best to simply run a new wire from A to B outside of the harness.
beenthere-dunit more often than I care to remember and the reason why all my Skorpions got new DIY harnesses.

[harold]

Thanks Bill. As usual, you have explained things in a logical manner.

[harold]

Well my neutral switch tested bad, or at least it did when I got done with it. There is a ball bearing sticking out the end that is inside the engine, and it seemed stuck, with me thinking that it moved in and out to connect the ground. It wasn't showing ground to start with, and still didn't after I pushed enough to free the ball where it did move in and out. SO, I have ordered another switch.

But, that wasn't my problem, or was just one of at least two. I grounded the wire that hooks to the switch, and still no light. I know the bulb is good as I have put it in the turn signal socket and it works. Now I have to take the headlight out to get to the wires again and see if the positive isn't positive, or the ground isn't connected. Simple enough, but a hassle none the less. Small wires and bad eyes don't mix well.

My question is what would any of that have to do with the fact the starter motor works in gear without using the clutch? My sidestand switch has been removed. In gear, a good neutral switch is doing the same thing as one that isn't working, not connecting ground to the wire, right?

[djsbriscoe]

The neutral light has nothing to do with the starter motor as far as I know. Dismiss it from your mind so you can narrow down the broken wire in the harness. Get a multimeter and do continuity checks on the wire between the plug below the headlamp and the bullett connector near the frame above and to the right (just follow the wire from the switch and you will come to a bullet connector). It's best to get a pair of insulation piercing probes and plug them into the multimeter to narrow down the break. If you dont want to bother just fit a new piece of wire between the multiconnector and the aforementioned bullet terminal. You can get splice connectors that will allow you to join the end of a new piece of wire onto an existing wire.

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&rl ... 80&bih=761

David

[harold]

Thanks David. I didn't think the actual light had anything to do with the starting circuit, it's just strange that both are messed up. The bike only has 1,500 miles on it, too few I think for wires to get broken from flexing. However, one of the PO's has messed with the wiring by the battery, and I think there is a good possibility that's where the problem is. I will check the wiring at the light bulb to see if one or both of the wires are disconnected, and trace back to the battery. If I am correct, which comes infrequently lately, the bulb should have 12 V with the key on; on one wire, and the other wire should be continuous with the one coming out of the neutral switch. When the neutral switch grounds, the light should come on.

What, and where is it located, whatever is supposed to keep the starter from working in gear with the clutch out? I can live with it like this, but would like to make things as safe as possible. You never know when you will have a brain fart.

[Bill Jurgenson]

The sidestand switch switches a relay which disables the starter circuit when the stand is down. But that is all there is. The Skorpion never had a clutch lever switch and as far as I can remember the neutral light circuit also had nothing to do with the sidestand switch. I may have forgottgen something since I removed the sidestand switch from the very beginning and my DIY harnesses had none of that kinda kindergarten krap.
"Naderized" Japanese bikes all have that three-way relay resp diode circuit. Not good to get used to not thinking. Very bad in fact.
Get into the habit of putting up the side stand first thing you get on the bike, then quasi automatically pulling the clutch lever, then starting. Starts easier when really cold, BTW, since the cluster does not have to churn the cold, stiff oil.

[ozzyjohn]

i have a 96 XTZ 660, sorry to crash your MZ site, that has a neutral light that wont go out regardless of what gear I am in. This allows the bike to travel with the side stand down, so where do i go looking to fix this problem. thanks in advance.
John

[chisleu]

The side stand switch is a different switch from the neutral switch. If the circuit logic is set the way you are saying, then your circuit is shorted to ground somewhere. If it's not the switch itself (test it with an ohm meter), then it's a wire "somewhere" which is not easy to find. You have to disconnect both sides of the wires in question and use an ohm meter to the frame to see if it's shorted. Hope that helps. I'm no EE or mechanic (although I built my megasquirt and installed my carb jet. hah)

That said, all the safety switches on my bike were disabled when I bought it. The sidestand, neutral, etc are all shorted so the bike will crank at any point. Scary IMO. I really wish the neutral switch worked so I didn't have to test if I'm in neutral with the clutch.

[harold]

It would be easy enough to test to see if it is your neutral switch. It is located right in front of your oil drain bolt, and has a wire on it. Take the wire off, and if the light is still on, then this wire has shorted somewhere in your harness. The neutral switch supplies ground to this wire to light your bulb, so if disconnected the light is still on, then that wire is grounded-shorted somewhere.

My problem was the opposite, I had no light. After my first new switch broke immediately, on the 2nd attempt I used an Ohm guage to see how far in the bolt needed to go to hit the ground. Adding a thin washer was all it took to fix it. The bolt was going in too far, which knocked the spring loaded tip off when the shifter drum moved past it.

[chisleu]

My problem was the opposite, I had no light. After my first new switch broke immediately, on the 2nd attempt I used an Ohm guage to see how far in the bolt needed to go to hit the ground. Adding a thin washer was all it took to fix it. The bolt was going in too far, which knocked the spring loaded tip off when the shifter drum moved past it.

I read about your problem but didn't see the resolution anywhere. (probably missed it.)

Thanks for that. I was wondering what caused that problem. My neutral light is out and I'm pretty sure it's been shorted because it will crank in gear.